I use isboxer to mine with 4 accounts. Never have pvp'd with it. I don't use constantly but might use it to activate auto pilot or to dock. If I'm reading this correctly, this action with be banned . So no point in having 4 accounts so might as well cancel 3 of them.

Elite dangerous is out soon. Maybe cancel all 4 and have a go at that instead.

I am sure that many accounts will be 'unsubbed' now that that they cannot be isboxed to cover the cost of subscription....

However, using an exploit to cover the cost of subscription isn't really subscribing, If no one spent real money on the game there would be no game to play.

ISBoxer is much more than a multiplexer/broadcaster. There are features of it that people can still use. But using it for things like isboxing bombers/miners/ratters is bannable now.

It isn't vague at all. the mechanic people were using, regardless of the application/device used, to broadcast commands across multiple clients at the same time is banned.

Even if you take a stick, glue it across 10 mice and use the stick so the mice all give the commands at the same time is covered by this because that is command broadcasting. Using a physical KVM to mirror commands to multiple systems would fall under the 'muleiplexing/broadcasting' rule.

CCP went much further than banning ISBOXER they banned any method of doing what people have been using ISBoxer for (vis-a-vis multiboxing bombers, etc). There are other features of ISBoxer that work well with eve that have nothing to do with multiboxing bombers/etc. And those features shouldn't, and aren't, bannable.

Damn, lot of folks pitching in on this and more even as I write.

ISBoxer is not banned, what it sometimes does IS. This has the benefit of if you make a new program called ASSBoxer that does the same as ISBoxer you have not found a way around the bans. If you use chopsticks and rubberbands to duplicate you have not found a way around. It is not the tool it is the application of it that is at issue.

I think this is a good move. It may cost a few short term, losses but I think a lot of players will appreciate the chance to be on even footing or forced to be with other players to do a group activity (one of the M's in mMo)

and I know I forgot to ask earlier . . . but yeah, I am helping out the FLOOD of new players coming into the game and so if you want to hand over the assets of a multibox mining fleet I will see that they get a good home and USED by individual players.

which is what I like

m

About time, several csm have been vocal about this. This is not about a tool, but about its use and what it does too eve.
Its very clear that if u use a tool to run a bomber wing by mutiplying single inout too multiple accounts its illegal.

Poeple doubting that like to cause drama, ratehr then actually reading the excact words.

Any drop in accounts will be countered by the fact that others stay in this game, cause they dont get blown up by 1 cheating dude.
Also compairing it with a normal bomber wing is silly. They lands not at excat same time, giving bubles and tackle a change, and the darwin law is mutiplied by 700% since people are people

Also the dude iskboxing 20 mining accounts wasnt going to use those too activly use those to make eve a more exciting place, rather then his own gain.

How that affects plex ,we ll see once it balances out. I am proud to ccp make again a choice out of principle rather then money. Blink, and the null sec changes, and this one show a new decade where ccp is in control of their destiny and game

One proud csm member!

funny thing is... he doesn't actualy need "broadcasting"/"automation functions".. and i hope he keeps mining them ice :D

Holy crap, how some people can't understand this and yet still manage to play EVE is amazing.

If you use a program to somehow input the same action in to more than one account at the exact same time, you are being illegal. It is not allowed.

If you have a keyboard macro that inputs F1-F5 one after the other to activate say a bunch of hardness. That is okay.

Pretty basic poop here. I dunno if it's more to counter isboxer bombers or more than likely farmers mining using 10 accounts all at once. Which you can still do but with more effort.

That is what I have been trying to say... This so called nerf to ISboxer does nothing. Why? Because a very very small percentage that used ISboxer multi broadcast while the majority used it with single.

So this hoopla that woot GJ CCP does nothing. They will still play, still kill you and in more numbers than 10 =)

Props to the guy who ran 30 accounts in pvp cause I have seen him do a 30 man fleet better than most of the 30 man fleets in eve.

Again lets recap:

1. Changes nothing.
2. You are still gonna die.
3. One guy can and will still do incursions with 10 acc.
4. Whoever used multi for mining or pvp anyways? I mean really?
5. Plex prices? Seriously? That's not changing anytime soon either.

How do you figure? If you are mining 2b a day with these 25+ miners, and a plex is/was say 850m, lets do the math

$15 x 25 = $375 per month.

However, if you are mining say 2b a day, for only 20 days a month out of 30, then your 2b x 20d = 40b

850,000,000 x 25 accounts = 21.25b

That still leaves you with a net profit of 18.75b/month isk.

And you tell me that you are PAYING to play? Are you sh!tting me?

Come on. What moron who profits 18b a month actually BUYS their game time. I may have been born during the day, but it wasn't yesterday.

As a small time multiboxer using 2-3 pilots at most, I am not happy with the changes.
I feel it takes away something from the game that I like to do on a small scale, because it's the only way I feel I can achieve some things in say lowsec without a bloody link-alt.

For me, this is a reason to reconsider paying my 9 accounts with actual cash. (No I don't multibox to plex)

Suffer short term losses of a Botting community er "Broadcasting" community.. to appease the Actual Playing community. Best Holiday present Ever. I will be glad to see the reduction of Bot-aspirant Behavior as CODE. would put it. Watch actual pilots moving ships more on their own instead of mass undocking 20 Miners or Cruisers at once. I much enjoyed the old days before ISboxer fully became a thing in EVE where you faught actual players not just clones upon clones. I have no problems with people using ISboxer to neaten up the monitors they use and for quick switching between screens. But I do hold issue with them piloting them all at once. Activating hardeners all at once, clearing out Belts all at once, or Destroying a fleet single handedly with their own private army.

Do not get me wrong, I am hella impressed with the skill it takes behind ISboxer armies fighting Lag and everything else to fully pull off some of those amazing kills. but I will not miss it

Shrug. Honestly in my opinionI don't see much changing.

I mostly use isboxer for the video FX features and windows layouts. so in theory i could easily switch to something like https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246157&find=unread if they did completely ban isboxer


It took me all of hour maybe to switch things tonight to be legit in two different ways one without isboxer and one with

First opinion you can use logitech or whatever software with a gaming pad or keyboard with programmable keys.

example I could of easily set it so 1st time i hit g3 button button on my logitech keyboard it sends as Command to switch to Window 1 + F1 next press switch to Window2 + F1 and on through the list. I could easily press the key 10 times in next to no time. 10 clients 10 key presses it's legal.

the command to switch the windows is happening on your machine not in game and not affecting the in game actions so its legal in my opinion but I can see some fighting the point.

Downsides This means setting up a ton of hot keys but still easy enough.
if you have one of your guys parked(afk cloaking) or not logged in you need to either modify the list or risk uncloaking or have wasted keystrokes.

Second option isboxer, I can make a round robin key with a action target group. each time I press the button it sends my desired key stroke to one character in the group until its sent it to all of them. 10 characters 10 key presses all legit

advantage if a character slot isn't actually running it won't try to send a keystroke to that character. if i want to park them (afk cloaking) somewhere changing the group membership takes next to no time.


Targeting I have always done manually too unreliable im my opinion to automate

I know in logitech you can set a button to ctrl + left MB click at a given screen coordinate so also setup your broadcast windows i the same paces. 10 button pushes 10 locked targets in what 1-2 seconds ?

I expect you can do the same with other vendors software also.

isboxer I can do this several different ways I would prolly go where do like before just add the Video Fx feature

just means it opens a little video fx(think video feed of a given size) around current mouse location so i can see where my mouse is on that character screen click and it sends a ctrl left click 10 key presses and 10 left clicks 10 locked targets
with broadcast windows again you can easily lock targets in a nominal amount of time.

it wouldn't be a pure 100% alpha strike like you can with broadcast targeting however the time difference will be for most part insignificant in my opinion.


Moving around I never move all my guys at once through jumps with broadcast it's stupid and asking for you to lose stuff something is always eventually going to go wrong. So whatever.


If I'm moving around in system use fleet warp and done.


So we've covered targeting, activating modules/weapons and basic movement in legit ways with only the barest of time increases but there is a slight delay


I just don't see how it's going to change very much at all other than to be a way to ban the stupid or lazy folks that don't time to set things up right and legit.

I'm actually more concerned about False positives.

if CCP is relying solely on time delays between clients showing a key press to detect broadcasts thats just not going to work.

I can press one key 10 times in a second easily. thats 0.1 seconds per key press or 100MS and as I showed above that will send the commands i need legitimately.

so I expect CCP is going to include other standards for detecting broadcasts than just time. I also know they'll never tell us what they are and I don't blame them for not telling us either.

because in both solution I listed above you could build in buffer time delays between the key presses of a variable amount
so its never the same amount which can be used to try defeat time detections but frankly im pressing the key 10 times i dont need to add in crazy time delays

That's my only concern about this change is getting tagged as breaking the rules when I'm not.

I give CCP credit for trying to address what they perceive as a issue by the community.

It took courage knowing it was going to **** off a lot of folks and cost them subscriptions because the feeling is this is what the community wants.

But ultimately I don't think It's going to change a thing.

We are all a bunch of crazy inventive people when we choose to be and quit trolling each other.

I'm sure someone has already thought of even better and legit ways of doing things than I listed above too. Multiboxing in this game is worth the effort of thinking up legit solutions so it's not going anywhere.

My stand on ISBOXER's mirror ability has longtime been for *ease of use* or to excessively use a mechanic in the game that is inherently broken or overpowered. While I do support the removal of isboxer for BOMBing runs and maybe suicide ganking, overall the rest of the uses for it aren't too overpowered. I am worried about the economic inpact with the number of isboxing miners that will probably quit. Mining Sucks, if someone wants to use isboxer to mine it should be fair game.

whats so hard to understand there?
They dont want 1 man to do these things like there were 20 men in automated manner.
Freighter ganking is no problem, freighter ganking by 20 catalysts from 1 dude isbotted fleet IS a problem!

As someone who can read and understand English very well, no-one can understand what you are trying to say.

we are talking about an isbotted freighter gank right? When you play 1 client and other 19 catalysts are automated in background, right??
Input broadcast is form of automation, this is why its explicitely illegal now (actually always was, see EULA, part 3c) and why we have this thread here.

Indeed, never trust a man that can't do reading...

You forgot Claim 4, Einstein: Bloodraider smart-bomb ratting is making me 2b per hour in isk and about 1b in loot and svalage after seeing the "news" all I did was resub 4 more accounts

D.

it is, I see it so, CCP sees it so, many other people see it same way. Discussed lots of times already, not gonna do it again.
You're done, move on.


so, just because you havent seen something, it didnt happen? lol, shows how little you know.

So will CCP be compensating me for my IS boxer subscription I purchased 2 months ago?
Answer of course not.
Fine they want to bring this rule in, I donGÇÖt agree with all aspects as ore prices will sky rocket due to the lack of minerals on the market for one.
I agree itGÇÖs misuse in some areas could be a problem, but why selecting and dragging from cargo holds is a problem god knows.
I would only ask that they give us fair time like a 6 month warning.
Yesterday I cancelled subs on 10 accounts as of January I know I am not the only one so it will be interesting to see their end of year earnings in 12 months ^^

nah I dropped irrelevant parts...


I dont think so it is, per definition of automation. but you might have your own opinion, I dont really care,
all I care about is CCP's attitude in this matter, which I highly appreciate.

keep doing, but as you cant warp all of them with 1 click, some will get caught while you're warping them 1 by 1,
and this is exactly why recent policy change is good and long overdue.

6 months, don't be ridiculous. They were overly generous to give 1 month as it is. They could have given much less.

And can I have your stuff?

Why should the length of time the game has been out for have any impact on the grace period duration? People have a whole month to hear about the change and stop using the software in such a manner. That's more than enough.

I'd blatantly state, input broadcast was the primary reason for people to use it.


did he laugh in that popular didnt-want-it-anyways fashion?

how is this related to topic, idgi.
If you dont like how the game is played, using tools violating EULA is a safe way to get you removed from the game.


noone is talking about mass petitioning, just in cases where use of isbot or similar tool is obvious.


problem with bombers they can wipe out entire fleets. Being able to achieve something like that, which would otherwise require coordination of a decent group of people, by a single person, is way too OP and because of this I welcome this policy change effectively removing those isbotting bomber guys.

Great change, long overdue.

Unlike many in here, I do feel bad for the folks who are negatively affected by this. They invested a considerable amount of their time and energy building their huge fleets of miners and bombers and sansha-murderers within the rules of the game. And now they're hosed.

But it's for the greater good.

I might actually have to start logging in again soon.

this clause covers exactly isbotters input broadcast functionality.



which part of my statement is wrong? Feel free to correct it.

If I get ganked by ten players at a gate camp, that is fine and dandy.

If I get ganked at a gate camp by one ISboxer player it is wrong.

At least the ten gate campers had to organize the camp.

In any case, CCP have made their decision, so ISboxers need to adapt, stop using ISboxer, or well..rage quit.

No, it wasn't. The 3rd party tools part was and has always been talking about bots that require no input. I've told you a dozen times to do your own research yet you continue to ignore it to satisfy some bizarre hateboner against boxers.
I concluded that because you refuse to do even a modicum of research, and you continue to refuse to make a distinction between boxers and bots and classify all boxers on the same level of someone who RMTs or hacked the client to turn him invulnerable.
I'll ignore your pathetic attempt to dismiss my dismissal of 90% of the trolls in the thread who hate boxers simply because they got ganked once.
You just agreed with me that the clause is on a per toon basis. Comparing incursion boxers to a "public" fleet and attempting to say that there is accelerated gameplay is laughable at best, and outright lying at worst.

There's not really a ton of "solo" pvp available. I also don't multibox missions--I multibox incursions. I make maybe 60mil per hour per character. That's rather less than what people in actual groups make.

My "financial gains" go to keeping my fleet running. After PLEX and ship replacements, I have basically nothing extra each month. I don't mind. Running a fleet is fun in itself, and I enjoy the challenge.

I also do interact. As is the case with all incursion fleets, I sometimes get contested. I usually lose. So much for your "isboxers have an unfair advantage" claim.

Just a couple days ago a newer player commented on my fleet, I chatted with him for a while, handed him a venture and had him help me with the lyavite in the NMC sites. Interaction and content created. Normal incursion groups don't do that--if you're not in a well equipped BS or logistics cruisers, they're not interested.

Simple fact is that CCP is just giving in to whiners. Unfortunate that they're restricting the sandbox. Next they'll be banning scamming because it makes things harder for new players.

thought so....


Alt-Tabbing/Cycling through clients, moving mouse, clicking, pressing keys.. basically what used had to do if he had no input broadcast, things isbotter removes.


holy ****, why are you posting here then? You know exactly whats te points are being discussed here, stop intentionally derailing the discussion from the discussed, problematic uses of Isboxer to something harmless like window management.


here too, totally missing the topic of the thread.

lol, funny how people are grabbing at straws. Soon, half of isbotter population would have some random disabilities as excuse why they need to keep their isbotter :DDD

No, isbotter. You are a botter.

You are controlling 1 account, the other 10 are controlled by your isbotter software

The fact that you aren't afk doesn't make controlling accounts via 3rd party software ok. If a player is legitimately playing Eve on one account it doesn't mean he's suddenly allowed to run 20 botting mission runners in the background.

What a thread.

1 player using ISBox or some other technology gives 1 command input to multiple characters at the same time. This is what is explicitly no longer allowed and is a bannable offence.

That's pretty clear and concise. No reason for confusion there.

This is not the same as:

1 player alt-tabs between characters on the same PC giving the same command repeatedly but manually each time. OK. Makes it hard to control more than a few characters at any given time. Takes longer to get all the characters acting. Perfectly legal, no automation or multiplexing of the commands there. Hell, you could even use a KVM switch to go from one computer to the next...same deal. Because in each instance you have to input the command to each character manually.

It is also not the same as:

20 players controlling one character each working together in a fleet doing something. That's called teamwork...or multiplayer...or something...

But apparently a lot of the people playing this game are not capable of differentiating. That baffles me.

Maybe a lot of people are actually just mad over this change and are going all emo rage claiming they are either a) going to quit or b) going to flaunt the rule deliberately. When the rule gets enforced they will rage and gnash their teeth and rant against the injustice of it all.

Seriously, this is a video game. This change has obviously been made for a reason. The vast majority of feedback suggests for good reason. CCP and many players obviously expect it to improve the overall health of the game. So if this honestly ruins the game for you and renders you unable to play it and enjoy it...go do something else that makes you happy!

Actually, this is the correct argument to be made against the use of isboxer. If you are firing three ships worth of bombs with the click of a single button, you are indeed using input automation, which is the definition of botting. I never really cared one way or the other myself, because three guys using one ship each will always be superior to one guy using three. However, if you were being honest with yourself instead of trying to justify your lies, you would understand what is wrong with input automation. Bottom line, if you're one guy, taking on one guy, then why should you be allowed to have more than one ship to take him on with? This is an MMO, and make some friends if you wanna upgrade your numbers against your opponents. And even if we're talking about PVE, we're still talking about PVP to an extent, because everything you do impacts the game for someone else to some degree or another.

so? Then join a better corp.


there is no input from player on isbotted clients, just on the main one, the others are acting on themselves controlled by 3rd party software, which is pretty much botting.


yeah exactly this is and should be the natural limiting factor when multiboxing, your human capabilities. You are removing it by input broadcast tools, which is wrong in my opinion, in opinion of hundreds of other people and now in opinion of CCP.


doesnt matter how much isk or time it costs, ISK is not a balancing factor at all and time, well, if you isbotters take the time to setup the whole things, its probably worth the time because you receive more advantages from it than disadvantages, otherwise you wouldnt do it, right?

so what? CCP changed their stance, after isbotter abuse was about getting out of hand.
Why do you quote old statements, they are by now invalid.

No, they didn't explain botting at all, they explained what was against the rules AT THE TIME. The rules are changing.

Hope that clears things up for you.

because I knew its wrong and gonna get banned at some point in the future.

No it doesn't explain that at all. Now pay attention and stop making excuses - if a player sends one command, and a script replicates that command to be carried out across other clients, that is botting. CCP didn't define botting, they defined what they were and weren't going to allow in the game at the time. Nowhere in what you posted did CCP say "Botting is...". What they said was, "here is a clarification of the EULA". Are you high or something? How are you not getting this? Is it wilful ignorance or are you just huffing glue today?

Let me simplify this for you.

Pushing a button to send a command to one ship = not botting.

Manually pushing that button five times to send commands to five ships = not botting.

Pushing one button to send five commands to five ships = botting.

Botting is defined by input automation. The third item on that list is input automation. What you are doing, if you do this, is botting. Previously, this kind of botting has been allowed by CCP. Now, no longer.

For one, I'm not some silly whelp that thinks I need multiple accounts to enjoy a video game. For another, EVE isn't a second job so I'm not gonna treat it like one by working 8 hours a week multiboxing mining barges just to plex my PVP account because I'm not a cheap schlub that can't afford the very low cost of a subscription.

For another, if I'm pvp'ing against one person, why does that one person get to fight me with multiple ships using a single command relayed across all of them with a script? I don't care if he wants to try to multibox a logi or two, but I'll be damned if I'll be beat by some script-kiddie with 20 stealth bombers all slaved to one keypress.

I'm allowed to do a lot of things that I choose not to, and I'm not gimping myself at all. Challenging oneself =/= gimping oneself. As a result of challenging myself, I have grown stronger and smarter as a PVP'er. I guarantee you anyone using multiple accounts for PVP would be incapable of doing any good with only one of them. Hell I don't even use scouts unless I've got friends around.

CCP encourages multiboxing because they make more money from it. Players then dupe themselves into thinking they need to multibox to 'do well' in the game. I'm evidence that you only need the one to enjoy it AND do well.

Heil Sansha. Whelp.

And if he's doing it all manually, and he considers me scary enough to have to use so much firepower, then kudos for him.

So i dont get it wrong i can ISBoxer still use to use Multiple Monitors for Multiple Clients as long as i pusch and klick for any client seperate ?

The following screenshot is a good example of why input broadcasting had to be banned: http://i.imgur.com/fJMNIWi.jpg

It is an image taken from a hi-sec anomaly. There was around 75 miners present, 50 of them controlled by one person using input broadcasting, with immersion breaking names such as isbotter1, isbotter2, isbotter3, all the way up to isbotter 50. 15 were controlled by another person using input broadcasting, the rest were some small groups of people and a few randoms.

The 50 man isbotter had his freighter and orca bumped away, but said this doesn't bother him, and continued to strip mine the belt dry in no time at all. He admitted to having a second 50 man group of skiffs, currently actively in nullsec.

EVE does not benefit from having this kind of player in the game. They drive other players out of content and out of the game, while contributing nothing financially themselves. This means they have the same detrimental effect on the game as botters. Input broadcasting should have been banned a long time ago.

Part of what contributed to this is allowing people to pay for gametime with isk by purchasing PLEX from the market. It meant that some people created far more accounts than they would otherwise have made if they had to pay real money to subscribe each account. I wonder what would happen if CCP removed the ability to use plex to cover subscription costs. PLEX has many uses now, they could keep PLEX, but just remove the function PLEX has to add subscription time to your account. This would mean all players must contribute financially to EVE in order to play, in the form of subscription time. All the while, keeping the PLEX system in place with all its other uses as a means to generate extra income for CCP.

Execllent point

Well I just unsubed all 9 of my accounts. Not just because of the multiboxing thing.
CPP ramming way to many changes at once.
I play games if there fun. When there not.... oh well

I don't buy it. CODE took miner ganking and bumping to an extreme and there hasn't been a response by CCP on that.


Wasn't the drone assist limit the result of mass petitions? I forget exactly how it came about since I wasn't in a null bloc at the time.

Goon tears have major influence on CPP.
...

Which just makes them tastier when they don't!

Seriously though, this thread demonstrates just how much are they used to getting things by overheating Rapid Tear Launchers.

I feel sure that some kind of internal memo has made the rounds at CCP, if banning really is taking place I would attribute it to other reasons.


o7

It jives with the stipulations in the OP. only allowing one client at a time means you won't be affecting -anything- in an adverse or imbalanced way. So multiple accounts would be limited to people who do industry or research chains, and such. It seems to be the pure game people want. I'll be honest with you, fleeting with 8k DPS in subcaps including logi is kind of broken, don't you think. if I eat someone alive with a multiboxed setup, even if I didn't use keystroke broadcasting... I still faceroll them by using 8 clients. key broadcast changes nothing

Just because CCP makes a change doesn't mean it's good or with thought.

I hardly believe that it takes hours to set it up. And any variation to window positions can easily be prevented.

Use the function to reset all window positions, which is built into eve. Then repesoition the windows on all your clients at once -> done. Sure that takes 5 hours to do right?

Also the amount of workload to built in a cheat does not justify the use of it.

To go with my previous example of aimbots. Just because it is surely not an easy task to actually programm your own aimbot, it does not justify the use of it. (Before you read something wrong into it: I am talking about programming it yourself, not installing a script).

not quit. farm to play for free like I should have done for a long time now. it means I'm playing more.

I need to start ganking too.

For the record, I've never petitioned a multiboxer. As I've stated previously, I've always learned to adapt to the challenges presented to me by both the game itself and other players. I've only ever petitioned one lost ship, which was returned to me, and unrelated to multiboxing (it was a Succubus which I lost due to DDOS'ing), and all other petitions have been bug reports, asking if such-and-such activity and/or possible exploit is allowed, or reporting extreme cases of abuse and/or harassment.

And look, if this rule change wasn't happening, I'd continue on my way same as before. But it is happening, and I can't say I don't agree with it. I've never lost a ship to this, but if 160 tornado guns can be fired with one button push, by one player who can't be arsed making friends to fly 19 tornados with him in the multiplayer game, then I do have a problem with that. Whether or not I can adapt to it is unrelated to whether or not I like it.

I tried to find this program "Video FX" and all I could find was a video editing program. Is Video FX the correct name?

Oh I'm fully aware of how rule interpretations go, I just can't see them banning "normal" multiboxers any time soon, which means other methods of controlling clients with 1 click per client click will generally be safe. This means the likelihood is banning broadcasting is going to have little effect on what the whiners are whining about. So the net result will be some reduced subs, whiners still whining and isboxers still gaining an advantage, because once again CCP are avoiding tackling the problem in favour of trying to work around it.

Yeah, I like the CPU and FPS restrictions in isboxer. Lowers the amount of impact running extra clients has. The rapid screen swapping (I don't need to alt tab, have 2 global hotkeys which cycle back and forth through windows) and Video FX to dxNothing bit is pretty cool too. Amusingly, following this announcement I've resubbed isboxer and played around to get a decent no broadcast setup.

As owner of 5 accounts that do industry. ISboxing kills the fun of running multiple accounts. What is the challenge? +1 ban ISboxing

edit: PS should have done a long time ago

Would be nice if you stop complaining about the "countless hours" you had to invest to set up your cheating prog. It's completely irrelevant.

FWIW I fly shiny enough to and already have previously flown with the majority of incursion communities... which is one of the reasons I'm not posting on my main in a thread where any of the emotionally involved participants might well have 10+ gank alts to take their rage out with.

I'll probably see you (or one of the others of clan Baboli) in fleet again later tonight, maybe Nolak as well lol

And no, I don't ***** about the lack of fleets but nor do I have the time to FC or run a community (or have the desire to create a little sandcastle fleet to play on my own with)...like I say, if fleets are down, there's other forms of entertainment in life, the cut and thrust of public debate being one for example.

Commited, satisfactory loners could be another way of putting things....and I really think you're overstating your relative stakes - sure you might be buying a lot of plex on the market with your in-game earnings, but that doesn't correlate to a real-life income for CCP.

The people who bought those plex for RL cash and then sell them on the market are the ones that are paying for the game, a long time before your (or my) incursion iskies arrive on the market.

You're not a whale, you're a leech (same as me, only X times worse).

Seriously Lucas.. Have you ever tried to multi box an incursion? Have you ever done and incursion? Do you honestly think this change will not stop 1 man incursion fleets?

In an incursion, if you had to lock up and fire on each target manually, you would have lost half your fleet before you got the 1st target locked. Just managing logi and DPS is a pain, even when using software.
As for 1 man bomber fleets, the ability to insta lock and fire on your prey with 1 click removed will put an end to it. No-one is going to decloak 10 or more bombers then have to lock the target with each one manually. Bombing runs would simply fail as the delay between each bomber launching its bomb removes effectiveness and more than that, gives those you are trying to bomb time to react (dead bombers everywhere).

Jump on sisi with 10 trial accounts and a friend, use rookie ships ( no training needed) and go try to lock up your friend and pop him before he has popped half your fleet.

Multi box miners will be the most affected and I'm not so sure that is a good thing for players as a whole. For CCP it could be a boon.

mining is fairly noble, imo. players need miners. in contrast, no one needs incursion runners.

despite incursions being level 4 missions on steroids, it makes a difference what players do with incursion income. if it's to support activity elsewhere in the game, that makes sense to me. farming incursions to support a lossy PVP habit, for example. but those players whose mains are -all- incursion pilots, and their only goal is green, blue, and purple incursion ships? it really doesn't contribute to the pulse of this game.

when it comes to key broadcasted fleets... miners drive prices down. incursion runners... not so much.

As a multiboxer who hates isboxer and all input broadcasting, I'd just like to make one point.

If you see a fleet of characters warping from gate to gate all at the same time, you don't need to cheat to do this. Warp gang to stargate, and then right click stargate and select jump on each character. Simple.

I was never really interested in ISBoxer before. But with all the sniveling and whining going on, I think I'm gonna give it a try....

Uni-matrix 1 to 50 was in elonaya today with 50 skiffs/procurers all mining at once. is it even possible to control 50 at once without isboxer?

I use alts Shadow but I don't need or see any need to simultaneously control them with duplicated inputs.

WoW is a completely different kettle of fish EvE is niche for reasons beyond multiboxing otherwise why didn't it have 11 million players before the nerf when it effectively DID have unlimited multiboxing?

Verisimili, one of the best multiboxers in the game has apparently been banned

He's the one who created this video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFdYO9h0H3Y

Showing how to multibox in EVE without using input duplication and using what we thought were allowed usages.

We dont know they aren't allowed, but in CCP's extremely vague definition he was banned per his words. All his isk was confiscated as well.

He had a ticket into CCP asking if there was any issues with what he was doing, their response? Banned without any answer.

Wanna know the WORST part about this?

CCP Falcon stated on 2 podcast's that the best solution was to send in a petition to start a dialogue with CCP. He stated their would be no repercussions and made comments that CCP is looking to help, not ban, its players.

Listen for yourself

http://t.co/Tzs4NYanpu @ 1:14

and

http://show.gamingradio.net/podpress_trac/web/181/0/GRNShow250115.mp3 @ 2:07

This is still completely anecdotal, been waiting for your evidence of this for some pages now.

Input Broadcasting's Unfair Advantage:
Normal Fleet 20 people- FC" primary is 123 everyone target 123 primary 123." 20 people have to find 123 and target then point and attack. roughly 5 seconds maybe less or more for all 20 to target him.

Multi box fleet- Turn on input broadcast all target 123. All do this with in milliseconds from each other.

Huge gain in this as you can see you dont have to rely on others to target as you know that 90% of the time all 20 will target that guy.

Round Robin:
Round robin does send 1 command to 1 client but at will send that command as fast as you can click or activate that shortcut. So you can send 1 command to 20 accounts seperetly yes but with in milliseconds.

Huge gain as a normal fleet will some times take 1 to 5 seconds yet again to activate the modules.


Honestly if you used the Input Broadcasting and Round Robin features there should be no argument on why they banned it. The argument is for them to be more open about whats now allowed.

I am using the 120 xkey version btw.

http://xkeys.com/xkeys/xk128.php

but i am currently experimenting with a usb touchscreen, cause i can adjust keys faster.

and ccp allowed using touchscreens for input.

(4078)
You've already admitted that ISBoxer can be used to break Eve's EULA/TOS & policies. Why are your here arguing with yourself?

Edit: Still waiting for that 1 bil isk you promised.

can't believe im saying this but i feel like CCP needs to take a leaf out of blizzards user handbook when it comes to how to handle customers

You might want to talk to Nolak then, since he's blowing your cover with his ranting about Teamspeak and EveMon and stuff.



And thus far, the one time someone has tried to provide proof to me of that, they exposed another person using macros.

So I really don't buy that. No one ever got banned for alt tabbing, and no one ever will. This sneaky **** with keyboard macros, auto scrolling, and twenty client windows? I certainly won't miss anyone doing that.

so many post and comments to sort through. (sorry for asking) Just a question. (returning eveplayer 8 accounts used to use innerspace)

can we still use inner space to place accounts in a tile. ex: view full game screen on, lets say 6 clients on one screen?


I can click on w/e for each accounts one by one. I dont care about broadcasting i jsut want to tile my accounts,, if not then ill have to manage with window mode.

There are no boundaries in space...

I saw first hand how they detect it, and who they banned and at that point that where zero wrong banns or dectections in it. It falls under nda but was pretty awsome too see. Also the sharp drop when dcp chnaged rules from people who adjusted their gamestyle wihtout the detection and punishement, its hardly random or debatable detection, its pure math

Note he said no false positives up to that point. We do not have enough information to make any reasonable conclusions.

For example, if the probability of a false positive is 0.001 and they used the detection software on 100 suspected players, there is a 90% chance of having 0 false positives. Of course, as time goes on there will eventually be a false positive.